Plotworld Ship Building

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BWOT

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#1
- : - : - : - SHIPS - : - : - : -
Hello all, there is a new place to build ships. This area will be a hub for all ships on the server. /warp Shipplots to access to the location. The organization of this project is still at the beginning however at the moment we do have some aspects which are open to Artist+.

A realism guide in-game and out will be coming soon but for now here is the first plot build for ships:





CURRENT SHIP BUILD:

INTRO:

Hey everyone! didi here for a special message to all builder ranks! As some of you may know I have been working with @BWOT in the past few weeks on ships and after a small discussion we have decided that its best to open up a ship build/plot build!

HOW IT WILL WORK:
BWOT and I have set up an area in /warp shipplots which we will use for this plot build. The ships you will be making, if you choose to build here, are small cargo ships for the city of Dol Amroth and surrounding regions. Now I do not expect anyone to be an amazing ship builder so that is why BWOT and I will guide you with the basics (I have made two ships your welcome to take a look they are bigger than what you will be making)
We want to keep the style that I've started so make sure to take a look at those ships.

BWOT has made a plot which has all the technical aspects you need to follow in order to have a plot. I have also set up a board on top of the area for the ship build, so if you do want to build a ship; make sure to tell me and/or BWOT.

A small note on how the plot works; BWOT or I will give you details of a ship (richness level, sail color and blocks we would like you to use mainly). When you see the plot BWOT made with info and details you will see how to mark that you're done, when you are done make sure to message me or BWOT and we will both check your ship and accept it and copy! I can personally say that I will be in the ship build a lot so I will be adding comments on each plot. BWOT and I will be strict on these ships (but not on creativity) because we want them to come out great and not all out the same!

If you need any help or information be sure to message one of us" Good luck to all and I hope to see most of you builders coming and asking to build a ship!

Further information and details are on the board on top of the ship build area & in the example plot made by BWOT
 

ryttyr

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#5
Whilst I can't take on a ship build for the time being I do have a ship in Eaglz's shipyard that he never had time to evaluate before he was banned. It's a historical build based on a real life ship type that I believe to be realistic to have been built in the area of Dol Amroth and southern Gondor. It may not be of the style you want but I'd be glad if you checked it out anyways. It's the small, not yet accepted ship on the north side.
 

didi45

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#6
Whilst I can't take on a ship build for the time being I do have a ship in Eaglz's shipyard that he never had time to evaluate before he was banned. It's a historical build based on a real life ship type that I believe to be realistic to have been built in the area of Dol Amroth and southern Gondor. It may not be of the style you want but I'd be glad if you checked it out anyways. It's the small, not yet accepted ship on the north side.
If the ship yard still exists I'll take a look
 

Eaglz24

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#7
Make sure they're not napoleonic ship of lines this time, and for the love of god don't square-rig them; 14th century is about the latest you should aim for.
 

BWOT

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#8
Make sure they're not napoleonic ship of lines this time, and for the love of god don't square-rig them; 14th century is about the latest you should aim for.
;) got you covered
 

Eriol_Eandur

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#10
I disagree very much. You can't use 14th century ships as example for gondorean ships. The background doesn't fit at all.

In 14th century european seafaring was still very limited to areas near the coast and the quite sheltered mediteranean sea. Open ocean travelling started not before late 15th century. At that time ships were still very dangerous to cross open oceans and got lost quite often.

In contrast Gondor has a 6000 years tradition of open ocean travelling. The Numenoreans learned how to make secure open ocean ships during the first millennium of Second Age. Tolkien described their huge ships many times. The numenoreans explored all oceans of Arda (east of Numenor).

Obviously shipbuilding was much higher developed in Numenor (and Gondor) than in 14th century. In terms of technical development16th to 18th century would fit much better with one big difference: The power of Numenor on the oceans was never challenged thus they did not have war-ships with many cannons. Tolkien thought more of mobile exploration bases and huge transport ships.
 

didi45

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#11
I disagree very much. You can't use 14th century ships as example for gondorean ships. The background doesn't fit at all.

In 14th century european seafaring was still very limited to areas near the coast and the quite sheltered mediteranean sea. Open ocean travelling started not before late 15th century. At that time ships were still very dangerous to cross open oceans and got lost quite often.

In contrast Gondor has a 6000 years tradition of open ocean travelling. The Numenoreans learned how to make secure open ocean ships during the first millennium of Second Age. Tolkien described their huge ships many times. The numenoreans explored all oceans of Arda (east of Numenor).

Obviously shipbuilding was much higher developed in Numenor (and Gondor) than in 14th century. In terms of technical development16th to 18th century would fit much better with one big difference: The power of Numenor on the oceans was never challenged thus they did not have war-ships with many cannons. Tolkien thought more of mobile exploration bases and huge transport ships.
I know eriol don't worry about it I got it handled I wasn't planning on using those years
 

BWOT

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#12
I disagree very much. You can't use 14th century ships as example for gondorean ships. The background doesn't fit at all.

In 14th century european seafaring was still very limited to areas near the coast and the quite sheltered mediteranean sea. Open ocean travelling started not before late 15th century. At that time ships were still very dangerous to cross open oceans and got lost quite often.

In contrast Gondor has a 6000 years tradition of open ocean travelling. The Numenoreans learned how to make secure open ocean ships during the first millennium of Second Age. Tolkien described their huge ships many times. The numenoreans explored all oceans of Arda (east of Numenor).

Obviously shipbuilding was much higher developed in Numenor (and Gondor) than in 14th century. In terms of technical development16th to 18th century would fit much better with one big difference: The power of Numenor on the oceans was never challenged thus they did not have war-ships with many cannons. Tolkien thought more of mobile exploration bases and huge transport ships.
Idk where you going didi as you seem to say yes to both opinions.
But for me I think the 14th age style would fit much better, I believe that making 16th to 18th century ships would not fit well with the surroundings and the current ships we have. I am not disagreeing that they can be a bit bigger due to advanced tech however some of the parts on those ships are just too out of place. Also as a technical point of view, it would require many more blocks to get the detail which is put into those ships.
 

BWOT

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#14
This is all good but just goes to show that Numenorians were much better off than the Gondorians possibly were. So I think that the royal ships of Dol Amroth can be bigger and grander in style but everything else should stick to 14-15th century age ships.
 

Eriol_Eandur

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#16
Maybe we are not talking abou the same ships. I found this (correct me if I'm wrong):

In 14th century (1300 - 1400) a typical ship type was the cog like this
In second half of 15th century caravels was developed. This was the ship type used by the great exploration journeys. This one for example was the flagship of Christopher Columbus (unclear if it was a caravel or carrrack) when he first crossed the atlantic ocean (1492):
So this is the latest ship development at the end of 15th century.
If we are going to limit ships in Gondor to this we will need to remove almost all ships that are already there.

In 16th century caravels and carracks became much larger end were further developed into galeons.

I quickly checked our ships in Pelargir and Dol Amroth, most large ships looks like galeons or the even later Fluyts.
 
Last edited:

Eriol_Eandur

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#18
@BWOT maybe it's just me, but think many exsiting large ships at the map clearly go over your examples. To me these ships in Pelargir for example look much more like those 16th and 17th century galeons I posted above :p
upload_2018-2-28_16-46-24.png
upload_2018-2-28_16-48-44.png
 

BWOT

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#19
Whos ready for a ship revamp :p ,well if this is true then I think we should really think about this in future builds of ships, it would make more sense imo in going for an earlier style. Maybe we can snatch some styles from 16th but I would rather stay earlier. I am actually surprised though @Eaglz24 that you have a new turn on the style which should be used. If I remember correctly you previously went (in your guide) for 16th-18th century and square-rigged ships for the Numenorians and then said that many of these ships fell to Gondorian hands and that knowledge would have been passed down and then in conclusion the ships would be square-rigged, late age of sail and 17th -18th style. Just wondering what was the cause for the change of heart?