The Sun and The Moon

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arathorn867

Slab Fanatic
Jun 9, 2014
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Berlin
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#1
So this might not be the right place/way of starting this conversation - any bounders or staff please delete/move if so!

So in Tolkien lore, the sun and the moon are objects being guided through the heavens by a pair of lesser Ainur, known as maiar. One was Tilion, who guided the moon. http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Tilion. The second was Arien, mistress of the sun. http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Arien.

The sun was, at least in some parts of the lore, a huge ship or vessel that contained the last fruit of the golden tree through the sky, and then through the roots of Arda.

The moon was a silver island containing a great pool of the light of the silver tree. it also was the home of a nameless white elf, and may have had some building, hills, and trees besides.

The roots of Arda (not sure what the correct name is) is a series of massive, maze-like caverns and pillars beneath the world. the sun and the moon travel through while the other is in the sky (except for when tilion chases arien, and both are in the sky at once).

So the real point of this post. Would it be possible, or has it been considered, to somehow introduce these facets of lore into MCME? Perhaps two or three dimensions could be introduced allowing visits to the sun and the moon, and maybe the "underworld", a re-texturing of the sun/moon, or even just a couple of themed builds at a later date. I have heard rumor that at some date in the future, Valinor might be built, which would include the harbors of the sun and moon, so maybe this is a bit early to discuss, although I don't think it would be overly difficult to introduce, as it is relatively minor. (I think, I don't really know anything about running a server. For all I know this would blow up the world, which would be rather lore accurate.....)
 

Portalrules333

Hardcore MCME-er
Apr 9, 2014
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#2
That would be cool for sure, Arathorn! I would be all for your dimension idea! I can't say for sure whether or not it will actually happen though...
here's hoping!
 

djax74

Hardcore MCME-er
Mar 1, 2014
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France, but Valinor on week-ends
#3
In the Third Age, sun and moon are just like our sun and moon. The earth is a sphere orbiting around the sun and the moon is orbiting arond the earth. It could have been really cool,but it wouldn't match the lore though.
 

arathorn867

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Jun 9, 2014
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#4
The earth became a sphere, so the underworld would be gone or changed ( think the name may be the chasm of Ilmen, did some more research), but I think the sun and moon, or at least the moon, were unchanged. The sun was really only ever a chariot, but the moon was "an immense crystal island". Valinor and the Doors of Night were moved, but also still exist. Maybe this would just be best as a freebuild project after some more research.
 

DSESGH

Hardcore MCME-er
Mar 2, 2014
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#5
In any case, even if they were unchanged, normal people could not visit the sun and the moon:p
 

arathorn867

Slab Fanatic
Jun 9, 2014
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#6
In any case, even if they were unchanged, normal people could not visit the sun and the moon:p
But we're not normal, are we?

I think that there could be ways to manage getting to the sun and the moon. A warp is obviously one, but I think that if you really wanted to get into it, someone could build the paths of the air, which will potentially be needed when Valinor is built anyway, and have them access the sun and moon somehow. Maybe something like the waterfalls at the freebuild server spawn at some point along the paths.

For those who don't know, and assuming my lore is correct, the paths of the air were made when the world was reshaped so that the valar could walk over middle earth and still have access from Valinor. I believe that some writings suggest that the elven ships built by Cirdan were able to enter the paths of the air and thus come to Valinor in the end, Valinor having been separated from the rest of middle earth to keep men from trying to invade again.
 
#8
If Valinor was the beginning of the end of MCME the the sun and the moon would be the end of the end. =p

P. S. Roverandom would be the main source of material for building the moon.

And it might be that the elves saw and could travel "the straight path" but men sailed on a "bent world" (that includes new and unknown lands).
 

arathorn867

Slab Fanatic
Jun 9, 2014
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#9
If Valinor was the beginning of the end of MCME the the sun and the moon would be the end of the end. =p

P. S. Roverandom would be the main source of material for building the moon.

And it might be that the elves saw and could travel "the straight path" but men sailed on a "bent world" (that includes new and unknown lands).
Thanks, I haven't read Roverandom yet, gonna have to get it one of these days.

You say that like we are gonna build Valinor soon :confused:

I'm sure it won't be more than ten or fifteen years, don't be so pessimistic ;)
 
#10
If you're passionate about it then make it on the lore free-build. =D

Roverandom is set in Tolkien's Legendarium, however it is more childish than The Hobbit (which I really like) and the lore is more archaic. An example of the novel being part of an older legend is the precursor of Mallorn trees being on the moon). It also establishes the fact that the elves do not float in the air to reach Valinor but rather use their boats to sail their, on the water, but that oceanic path is flat and continues to Valinor while the water that human vessels float on is rounded. Uin the Whale in Roverandom swims to within sight of Valinor.

Another point I'd like to bring up is that the sphere-like moon goes under the earth, which is flat in Roverandom and is terraneous, having monochromatic terrain and flora and fauna.
 
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arathorn867

Slab Fanatic
Jun 9, 2014
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Berlin
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#11
I am thinking about building the moon and the doors of night at least on freebuild eventually, maybe the sun also. I think that Ilmen is a bit uninteresting visually from what I remember, so not planning on building that.